You guys have heard me rant on this topic before, so...
Since I have been playing drums again, about 1.5 years now, I have had a chance to play out at shows, some just back yard parties, some on the Mall in D.C. and county fairgrounds on big stages.

Here's my take. Live sound engineers don't really kinda give a shit. They kinda don't, even companies with emploies that are paid to do their job. I keep seeing this over and over again in a lot of different venues.

For example, the county fairground here has a large outdoor stage, I had a chance to play there. We were the first band to play that day. After sound check and our set, I played again with another band on hand percussion. From there on, their was nobody running the main board out front of the stage. They set it and walked away.

The band that played after, with no sound man paying attention, I could not hear the guy playing congas at all.

Rams Head Live in Baltimore sounds like a train wreck that never stops. Way Way to loud, can't hear the drums right.

Last weekend, I played with a friend at the fairgrounds but in the pavilion. When I got there, a girl was singing and playing guitar. I was at the end of the pavilion, her voice was so piercingly loud, I could not believe it. No sound man to be seen anywhere, the mixer was behind the stage. Was thinkin, can't you at least put some compression on that???

She was good but the ungineer was'nt doing his J.O.B. I got on later and could not hear the guitar well enough to play to. Looked around, no sound mann anywhere to be seen. I'm like, turn him up in the f-ing monitors dude!!! But, he was'nt there! Latr twards the end of the set he showed up, but no difference, the last song we played, I could'nt hear the guitar at all. I had to use the force big time. All I could hear was the reverberation swirlling around the pavilion.

Man I was so pissed after that, all day. Half ass sound men, f-ing with artists performance and sound. It's like having a half ass mechanic work on your car. But with music it's a little more personal. He knew I was pissed after the show even though I didn't say anything. What a bitch.

do your own sound or bring your own engineer whenever and wherever possible is the safest way to go as a live performer in smaller venue situations.

in the crap shoot of live sound engineers the full spectrum exists to be sure - there's shit and then there's Joe LePore! who I'm sure is THE shit... : )
either way it's an artists' job to communicate what they want to these folks, and to interact with them to help get what you want if you don't have your own person. it has to be a situation of mutual respect and cooperation with patience and no attitudes, and it really helps when the band does as much as they can to perfect their own mix themselves BEFORE taking the stage.

EXACTLY. My rules on the small things like that are simple: If you're not the headliner and you're a dick, I treat you like you treat me. If you don't bother answering the phone when I try to advance the show, you get what you get. If "I don't understand" that it requires the guitar amp to be turned to 11 on stage to "get your sound", I will not abuse the audience any more by trying to build my mix over that.

And you can ask sscannon about my mixing skills - he finally got to hear the results of me mixing one of his national shows

Ahhhhh....now I remember why I missed Jeremy...long meandering silly (but ultimately entertaining) and poorly spelled posts!!! YHEA!!! I particularly liked J.O.B (Jam On Brutha!) Phwew!

Thanks DP. Well this covers the gamot of live sound, everything from what is supposed to be professional sound engineers to back yard party guys. I have seen them all with piss poor results.

I have not been doing live sound enough to become as jaded as Joe (nor as skillful).

The band I work for went to in-ears as a result of shitty house "engineers" inability to get a consistent monitor mix for them, mixing while drunk and passing out during a show. As a result, the monitor mix is now stable, there is more room on stage for the band and their sound is consistently good - ok, it's great.

Part of my job is to contact the house sound guy, get a stage plot to him and work out the details of what he has for equipment a week or more before the show. Most of the sound guys I run across understand that the object is to have a great sounding production. They help with the setup, nuances of the room and peculiarities of the house equipment. It is their room and I am happy to have help. Since I have been mixing the band for a couple of years, I know the show, stage ques and sound that I want. I have only run across 2 real assholes in 2 years. I have seen many house guys text their way through a show which would piss me off if I was the band.

You basically do the best with what you have. A guy like Joe can take a band that is willing to listen to a pro and make them sound great. No one, not even Joe, can make a guitar player with his 200 watt, quad stack, cranked to 11 rig sound good in a small venue.

$0.02

Yes you can... you just need a 200 watt audio dummy-load resistor and a "Red Box"... like a power soak

Either that or a 4 foot table to put the said speaker cabinet on top of. Amazing when you point the guitar cabinet at the players head how it doesn't need to be that loud to get "their sound" anymore

But they have no problem aiming that at the audience's heads.

So true..

Guitar players are assholes.