I have a bunch of these singing acoustic guitar players coming in.
I like to use 3 mics(vox-2 guitar,neck mic being most disposable).
I realize this topic has been discussed to death, but it is a pretty regular occurance and i want to refine my approach as much as possible.

As far as seperation goes, aside from mic direction, what are your approaches to isolating the vox mic?
Do you have and setup tricks for this situation?
Does anyone use M/S for this situation?


I am really liking the sound of my royer 122 on female vox, unfortunately it's bi-directional and for this application that puts another factor into the equation, but i have been noticing that it creates a cool ambience that i wasn't getting with a cardiod on the vocals.
If i can get the phase right it sounds pretty cool.

I recently picked up a IBP phase alignment box.
I get to use it for the first time this afternoon. I will most likely use it on the guitar body mic, we'll see how it goes.

Man, your really asking for it with 2 mics on the gtr, i'd go with 1. Closest micing on both gtr and vox as possible. Or go direct with the gtr. No real sure fire way aroud this.

Yeah, i experimented alright.
If she stayed in just the right spot and played and sang at the right volume it was FABULOUS.
If she moved her head an inch or shifted in her seat, it was a disaster.LOL
I won't try to use bi-directional on vox in that situation again.
Oh well, live and learn.
We got some good stuff.
I just cannot deal with direct acoustic guitar. Can't do it.

Here's what has worked well for me. Use the Royer 122 on the guitar instead. Use the backside of the mic for more high end detail too. That should put the null of the mic pointing at the vocalists head. Then use a hypercardioid on the vocalist...a large diaphragm condenser with selectable patterns will be just the ticket here. If you position the mic at chin height and angle the mic slightly up towards the mouth, then that should put the null of the hypercardioid pattern pointing at the guitar. Tweak the position of both mics for minimal bleed. Then use the IBP (indespensible in this application) on either the guitar or the vocals and dial in the appropriate amount of phase adjust to make the bleed you do have work for you.

Good luck.

Brad

the only way i found to record this the best takes time but the finished product sounded great...

record with distant mic just to pick both guitar and singer

mic the guitar where you like im a fret person myself and dont let them sing but they can hear there first recording while recording guitar track

then trash the recording of both together and have him sing with his guitar track...the vocals will come out better also because they dont have to worry about playing the guitar and singing at the same time.

like i said will take time but the finished product is 2 seperate tracks...guitar and vocals

hope this helps

good luck

I have gotten good results taking the direct acoustic and reamping it. Also the Sansamp amp simulator plugin has saved it too. Maybe take the direct signal while miking the guitar as well, then see what you can get from reamping the direct signal, either miking a speaker or using a plugin. From the trenches,
Sean

You can mic both the vox and acoustic guitar and have near perfect isolation (in theory, I haven't tried this myself yet) but you are going to need two condensors both with figure 8 polar pattern. Have you got access to these?

I do a lot of this kind of recording myself. I have (on occasion) gotten someone who sings great when they're playing guitar - but can't quite get the phrasing of the songs right without playing.

I always end up tracking an amazing sounding acoustic track - then get a lackluster vocal track.

SOmetimes a workaround is to record the vocals on the first pass with a tiny bit of guitar in the background (use a directional mic on the vox).

Record the guitar track while you are doing this on a seperater track - then go back and overdub the real guiatr track.

Some of these people are more comftorble playing than singing and this seems to work well.

Just my oppinion and solution for one situation.

In the end - I would rather do a recording that was a little less perfect but got a great feel and performance.

I try to avoid taking guitars direct. Most of my work are these kind of artists and I have a nice selection of acoustic guitars ('59 Brazillian Martin 00-21, '62 Gibson J-45, old Guild D-55, etc...) it's kind of a waste to take a direct sound from one of these.

In my experience, the quality of the guitar makes a bigger difference than the mic or pre for this kind of music.

Yes, please go on.

If you have access to a pair of lavalier mics, you can try fastening them to the sound hole on the guitar, one to pick up EAD, the other to pick up GBE. The current crop of micro mics actually have a pretty good tone when used this way. Then use your fav vocal mic as you normally might.